Dedicated servers and Rage - news you probably don't want to hear
id Software might want to brace for some rage over “Rage”.
John Carmack, co-founder and technical wizard of the developer, says the company doesn’t plan to support dedicated servers for the multiplayer component of “Rage,” id’s upcoming new action game.
“It’s not cast in stone yet, but at this point no, we don’t think we will have dedicated servers,” he says.
Infinity Ward made the same decision for “Modern Warfare 2” and has been facing a massive backlash among its fans. The inevitable online petition has gathered over 183,000 signatures and even the developer has acknowledged the backlash.
“Modern Warfare 2” will use a matchmaking setup powered by IWNET for online play. It’s too early to say what Rage will use, but Carmack indicated he believed the servers are something of a remnant of the early days of PC gaming.
That said, he realizes the affinity many PC gamers have for them – and is glad “Rage” won’t be leading the charge away from them.
“The great thing is we won’t have to be a pioneer on that,” he says. “We’ll see how it works out for everyone else.”
Rage, meanwhile, appears to be on track for a 2010 release. But you might want to find a comfortable chair as you wait for the next “Doom” game.
“It’s looking realistic,” says Carmack. “We are on a crunch right now to do presentations for console first party manufacturers, so things are cooking along well for ‘Rage’. ‘Doom 4’ is obviously a bit further out.”
Chris Morris reports on the business and culture of video games and offers analysis of recent events and industry trends.
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Wii is the best console game among all, and I have even signed the partition for Modern Warfare 2 not having dedicated servers even though I don't have or want that game. Great post
Posted by: online puzzle games | November 26, 2009 at 02:26 AM
Having played almost anything which could be played on PC since "Ancient Art of War" on an orange phosphor screen on my XT and dabbling in online MP from the start, I can honestly say that the PC gamer experience is as much about discovering and cultvating the friendships which are spawned around dedicated servers is one of the most attractive elements of play.
Good games come and go, but the dedication of those who run the servers (and those who support them) is fundamental to the online gaming "community" everyone talks about.
It's been lovely playing ID games, but there are and will be other developers who really understand the gaming experience and give people what they need.
Posted by: -AAT-DUSTY | November 14, 2009 at 03:20 AM
EVERYONE PLEASE GO TO
http://forum.ea.com/eaforum/forums/show/3717.page
It is the official RAGE forum with the following description :
"My name is Peter Sokal and I am the Community Manager over at id Software. These forums are going to be a place where id will be able to communicate with you all with regards to all things RAGE in the coming weeks and months and I look forward to you all being a part of this community. "
If you feel as strong as I do about this bullshit about no dedicated server support and making RAGE essentially a crappy console ported game for the PC, PLEASE MAKE a new thread and lots of posts on that forum. I will do shortly. See you all on there!
If you complain about a problem but don't spend 2 min to contribute to pressuring them for a solution then you have no right to complain in the first place.
Pass on that link to everyone, youtube, facebook, twitter etc etc. We need to blow up that forum and others like it to get the message across.
I have even signed the partition for Modern Warfare 2 not having dedicated servers even though I don't have or want that game. We all need to get off our arse and make some noise!
Pass it on people.
Posted by: HandyAndy | November 11, 2009 at 06:27 PM
What's with this pathetic whining?
Posted by: xaml | November 11, 2009 at 07:08 AM
oh well id games are getting worse and worse even if this game had dedicated servers it would probably suck anyways
Posted by: fatman | November 11, 2009 at 02:43 AM
This is total horse sh1t. Dedicated servers created FUN and PLAYABLE environments and provide OPTIONS.
Dedicated servers provide an ECONOMY of SCALE.
More FUN more SERVERS, more GAMES SOLD
These assholes that decided that dedicated servers are irrelivant are hurting the consumer and 3rd party business class.
Posted by: Middleman | November 08, 2009 at 10:13 PM
No dedicated servers? No thank you, sometimes i don't think anyone understands why someone would rather game on a PC beyond using a mouse....
Posted by: Srafty | November 08, 2009 at 07:00 PM
Carmack, you´re a remnant of the early days of PC gaming, too! Just tell it as it is! You just sold your nerdy ass to the consoles! It´s all about the money and you just don´t have the guts to say it loud!
Posted by: dedicated_hate | November 08, 2009 at 06:44 AM
rage = meh
doom 4 = oh yah baby bring on the chainsaws!
Posted by: dead__last | November 07, 2009 at 01:08 PM
No dedicated server? Fine no need to buy that crap
Posted by: x2sagat | November 07, 2009 at 07:09 AM
It would be refreshing to play a game and not have to worry about downloading 10mb of custom garbage before actually getting in a game. It would also prevent people from putting malicious code into their 'mods'.
As far as dedicated servers go, I would like to see mods for a game have to go through an independent verification that it is stable and clean before being allowed. I understand this is probably not feasible.
Posted by: randyb | November 07, 2009 at 05:46 AM
If it's done well (really well) it could be good, I'd opt for 'virtual servers' servers which float around the cloud, administered by those who made them... In such a way it looks like there's still dedicated servers which communities can form around. These 'servers' would be formed by every client connecting to each other, and some seriously taxing brain power to work that element out. With no cheating and dropping back to a 'nominated' client which is all the evils of dedicated servers made worse.
I'd also throw in if you've got multiple clients on the same LAN attempt communication though IPv4/6 multicast.
Posted by: Steven | November 07, 2009 at 01:40 AM
All you guys just need to get over it. Dedicated servers suck. I'm not even trolling. After a hiatus from PC gaming for a couple years, trying to go back has been like pulling teeth.
It's hard enough to find a server with decent ping that isn't full, but then most servers have retarded mods and other junk installed, huge custom maps that can't be downloaded before the end of a match, and so on. Good riddance. I welcome the casual future in matchmaking and playlists.
Posted by: tpm7000 | November 06, 2009 at 11:36 PM
Well, hopefully they'll take a second look and put them back in when Modern Warfare 2 comes out and gets (hopefully) trashed by PC game critics. Even if we lose Infinity Ward, at least we'll get better stuff from id because of it.
Posted by: Firestorm | November 06, 2009 at 01:20 PM
Not going to buy this junk. No dedicated servers, no money from me.
Posted by: Doug | November 06, 2009 at 12:54 PM
I would like people who review games, both on pc and on console to ask the devs what their vision and idea behind "moving away" from dedicated servers are?
From my POV it looks like this is their response to piracy, to get money somewhere they need DLC, and to have DLC they need to exclude modders, and that in turn removes dedicated servers ( since you can't upload things and set your own rules on a central server ).
My question is though why make a multiplayergame where the multiplayer experience is inferior to older games? Why would anyone choose to play on a 250-300 ping server with a bunch of cheaters?
Think the bigwigs forget that most people have crappy connections and only a few select countries where people have at home access to 100megabyte optic-fiber-lines up and down.
Really the only way to fight piracy as a company is to make the multiplayer experience better, to make more people want to play the multiplayer game, and having unique cd keys is the only way to ensure that people actually paid for it. Essentially what they are now doing is trying to get fewer people to pay MORE by introducing DLC as only way to longivety. Result will be more and more people pirate the games and play them as singleplayer or via LAN b/c the multiplayer online is so inferior to what they are used to.
I mean really who will buy MW2 @ 50 dollars on PC to play singleplayer? Just fail at marketing.
Posted by: RandomFPSgamer | November 06, 2009 at 10:40 AM
Screw you Carmack.
You made the best shooter ever (Quake 3 Arena), but now I've lost all respect for your company.
Creating games for consoles and making cheap ports for PC gamers, yuk..
Cut the console crap; Consoles destroy real gaming and you (should) know it.
If this is what you want I hope all your games will fail in the future.
Posted by: PC gamer since Wolfenstein3D | November 06, 2009 at 10:18 AM
I'm fine with this if they can make quality games that have good stat tracking on central servers. I say let id do whatever's best for the game! Quit your whining...
Posted by: FlowClawDaddy | November 06, 2009 at 07:55 AM
Ok good to know, Rage will fail in MP. No need to buy, thanks for the heads up.
- Buy Rage 2010, UNCHECK.
- Buy BF:BC2, CHECK
Posted by: ROb | November 06, 2009 at 04:57 AM
Dear Mr Carmack,
I have been playing on xbox360 for a couple of years now (before I played a lot of games on PC), and I can tell you that Multiplayer on the 360 just is NO fun at all only because of not having dedicated servers!
If you do this to the pc community you will have lost all respect from that community, I can assure you.
You and Infinity Ward will be reckognized as the destroyers of PC-gaming for eons to come.
With kind regards,
JizLt
the Netherlands.
Posted by: JizLt | November 06, 2009 at 04:17 AM
Petition anyone? He needs to know what he is doing is wrong.
Posted by: BradleyKZN | November 05, 2009 at 08:58 PM
Is there something I missing here? How are people going to play online without dedicated servers? I'm no programmer, but I didn't think it was possible to have a smooth online experience (esp with lots of people at a time) without dedicated servers?
Posted by: PalmliX | November 05, 2009 at 07:02 PM
there is really no sound reason not to include a matchmaking system via listen AND support dedicated servers. no community = no longevity. also if modders cant do their magic, where are the developers going to get the ideas for the next game?
Posted by: classicoke | November 05, 2009 at 04:01 PM
I guess everyone will just continue not giving a s--t about RAGE, then. Dig your own grave, ID.
Posted by: TeddyLJ | November 05, 2009 at 03:22 PM
has he not been paying attention?
OFP DR has terrible multi
wolfenstein has terrible multi
http://www.xfire.com/games/ofdr/Operation_Flashpoint_Dragon_Rising/
http://www.xfire.com/games/wolfenstein/Wolfenstein/
see those death spirals? It is pretty clear what no dedis does.
Posted by: dave | November 05, 2009 at 03:17 PM
Source was a conversation I had with John yesterday afternoon guys. He's doing the rounds for the release of Doom Classic on iPhone.
Sorry, I can state with absolute certainty that it's not fake.
Posted by: Chris Morris | November 05, 2009 at 03:05 PM
Dumbest. Move. Ever.
What the heck do they need to look at Modern Warfare for?
Take a look at Grand Theft Auto IV's PC multiplayer, that's really bad and filled with haxers and stuff.
Posted by: WHITEHOTGAMERRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGE | November 05, 2009 at 03:01 PM
Source? Where was this interview taken, who took it, when? Looks fake to me.
Posted by: liquid | November 05, 2009 at 02:57 PM
...Because? Seriously, why deny people the ability to create dedicated servers? The only purpose this can serve is to eliminate the ability for users to create and host content so the developers can charge on DLC. The moment you do this you're basically saying "I care nothing for the consumer and only for their money". I thought Carmack was better than that.
Posted by: Winger | November 05, 2009 at 02:38 PM
It's cute that Id thinks they're still relevant.
Posted by: The guy with the hat | November 05, 2009 at 02:18 PM
WHY no dedicated servers?? Carmack would definitely have an interesting viewpoint on this issue, Chris. You should ask him.
Posted by: Gamer29319821 | November 05, 2009 at 02:15 PM
oh no, i was looking forward to doom3 too.
Posted by: who cares | November 05, 2009 at 02:14 PM
oh noes my hobbiez
Posted by: JP | November 05, 2009 at 02:10 PM
i'm freaking out guys
Posted by: wm | November 05, 2009 at 02:02 PM
die in a fire you traitor
Posted by: deathtocarmack | November 05, 2009 at 01:49 PM